The attention whore apparently isn't getting enough attention.
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Los Angeles
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sun, February 24, 2008 - 11:15 AMTHAT CREEP! ~ SCARY!
people~ hopefully~ are catching on to this IDIOT!
~he obviously doesn't care about America!!!!!!!!! -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sun, February 24, 2008 - 10:53 PMLook, I didn't support Nader's bid in 2004 & don't intend to vote for him this year, but these kinds of comments strike me as extremely unfair. Nader has probably done more for America than just about any other living American, & he's already gotten lots of attention in his life for his good deeds -- he doesn't need to run for president to get attention.
Nader is running for president to inject genuinely progressive ideas into a policy debate that studiously avoids things like single-payer health care & curbing corporate domination of our political system. Kucinich was doing that early in the primary season, but he's gone now. I'm personally very glad that people like Nader & Cynthia McKinney will continue to raise such issues right on through November. I would think that other people who call themselves progressives would welcome bringing real progressive ideas into the national discourse as well. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sun, February 24, 2008 - 10:59 PMYeah, and I haven't voted for him either. Al Gore has not listed Nader as the primary reason he lost, and Kerry didn't loose because of Nader, It includes voting fraud, The candidates often self absolving to make more progressive accomplishments, the lack of relevance people feel the politicians are to them, and the prohibition of voting prisoners and paroles.
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sun, February 24, 2008 - 11:13 PMI agree, Nader has done a lot of good, but I don't think running for President for the third time does anything new. At this point, it seems like he just wants the attention, but not the actual job.
If he were serious about changing this country, then perhaps he should run for Congress so he could actually do the hard work it takes to change the country legislatively. If Kucinich can win office, so could Nader. I think Nader would make a great Congressman, and he'd make a much bigger impact than running for president yet again. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sun, February 24, 2008 - 11:20 PMWell Nader will do what Kucinich did, albiet not nearly as well, bring out some of the problems that their opponents are not owning up to. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sun, February 24, 2008 - 11:53 PMsee to me, it would be better if you want people to discuss things to do it in a way that will get the populace and candidates to LISTEN.
ralph is really looking like an attention whore. maybe geo and i are wrong--but appearances count for a lot in politics. i think more people will roll their eyes than actually listen to the man.
i remember when ralph nader's voice held a lot more weight and he was doing "more for the country than any living human" (i personally think that's an exaggeration although ralph has done a lot.) he wasn't running for office then. -
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In his own words
Mon, February 25, 2008 - 12:15 AMonegoodmovemedia.org/movies/...hrun.mov
When I watch this, I don't see an "attention whore" or a man who "doesn't care about America." I see someone who cares deeply about America, who clearly articulates the very important issues currently being left out of the debate, & who articulates the need for "more voices & more choices" in the political process. -
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Re: In his own words
Mon, February 25, 2008 - 12:28 AMyou need the www on that one: www.onegoodmovemedia.org/movie...un.mov
i'm gonna watch it before responding to see if it alters what i would say to you. -
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Re: In his own words
Mon, February 25, 2008 - 12:42 AMalright.
i have a real hard time listening to nader talk as a candidate. i want to strangle him. is that fair? no. but...
...i think there's a better way to get his points across than running for president. frankly, i think the country would be better served with him as a gadfly COMMENTATOR constantly critiquing (or praising, although i think there would be rare opportunities for that) the candidates and ultimately the administration in office in 2009-? as it stands, he brings up the points now, but what happens in the interim between failed candidacies? the last time most americans remember hearing from ralph was 4 years ago--that's too long. -
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: In his own words
Mon, February 25, 2008 - 1:03 AMOK, I just don't get it. A progressive candidate with a long & honorable track record comes along to forcefully advocate for progressive policies in the presidential race, & progressives mercilessly attack him. Sure, Nader would make a good commentator, but he doesn't just want to comment on American politics, he wants to change the system of American politics. (This is the focus for the Green Party even more so.)
Are you saying you're satisfied with a political system that offered American voters the choice between two pro-war candidates in 2004, in the midst of the most misguided war in American history? And that when someone comes along to say that Americans deserve better, you want to strangle HIM?! I just don't get it. -
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Re: In his own words
Mon, February 25, 2008 - 4:28 PMI don't disagree with his policy positions, the problem is that he's a lot of talk and very little action. He's had at least three elections to try and do something concrete. He could build some sort of progressive party, use his name recognition to get other candidates elected, or run for a lower office himself. But he just hibernates for four years, emerges to speak loudly for a few months, and then disappears.
I want progressives who take action and are willing to do the hard work it takes to truly win office.
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Re: In his own words
Mon, February 25, 2008 - 12:35 AMHe lost the last of his credibility for me in 2004 when he started taking money from big Republican donors:
www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi
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Re: Nader runs again..
Mon, February 25, 2008 - 12:53 AMThis is good and we should all use him as much as we can. Now is the time to email the obama campaign calling for a single payer health care system. We have a health care system, Medicare, what we need is to make it universal. Either email or write the Obama campaign calling for a single payer system or email your congressman. Ask all your friends to do the same.
Now that Nader has raised the issue this is the time to push. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Mon, February 25, 2008 - 11:33 AM
In letters to Obama we might mention that the one and only way some of us will really believe that his promises on health care reform (and anything lse) are worth more than the breath they are uttered with is if Dennis Kucinich is invited to be Obama's VP running-mate.
Dennis Kucinich as Obama's VP running mate would convince everyone of Obama's sincerity, bring back most of the votes which will otherwise be siphoned off to Nader, and keep Obama alive through his term of office. Dennis Kucinich is the best life insurance policy Obama could possibly have as the military industrial corporate oil machine would do everything possible to keep Obama safe rather than killing him themselves if Kucinich would take office after Obama. -
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kucinich as vp
Tue, February 26, 2008 - 6:20 AMyeah, but if they take both of those guys out... we get pelosi, right? :(
i could get MORE excited about obama if dennis were #2, but i have a hard time believing that's even SLIGHTLY realistic. i'm thinking he's prolly gonna pick edwards (i think hill has been a little too rude to get the 2nd spot--but who knows, it's politics we're talking about.)
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Re: Nader runs again..
Tue, February 26, 2008 - 7:47 AMFinally! Someone TRULY progressive. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Tue, February 26, 2008 - 6:36 PM....... to get Nadar, McKinney and Dennis the same media respect for principle that Chisholm and other Demos who DEMANDED rights for working people, we'd need to go after Murdoch with a fervor against corporate trusts not seen since Teddy R. was in office. People.......
.....especially 'radical'/'anarchist'/progressives....etc. fergawdsake, drop your myspace!!
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Re: Nader runs again..
Tue, February 26, 2008 - 9:41 PM -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Tue, February 26, 2008 - 9:53 PM -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Tue, February 26, 2008 - 10:54 PMI wish Pat Paulsen would run... but he's dead.
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Re: Nader runs again..
Wed, February 27, 2008 - 4:42 AMthanks tedster! i'll let my lit professor friends know that it IS still possible to do satire! -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Wed, February 27, 2008 - 12:32 PMHe's some more entertaining video about Nader...
www.alternet.org/blogs/video/77583/
I do confess I did vote for him in the last 2 elections, but won't this time. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Fri, March 14, 2008 - 3:04 PMNader has absolutely done more for the people in this country than anyone in history, as far as I can see.
He has the clearest critique of the big corporate controlled political system which has shut his progressive angle out of Washington.
His very existence in electoral politics reveals the reactionaries within the "progressive movement." Those who blame him and think "anybody but Bush" was a good political angle are what's really wrong with this country.
Nader is principled. Can you say the same? -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Fri, March 14, 2008 - 3:26 PMi think you need to read more about dennis kucinich.
not only has he addressed all the things you're attibuting to nader he's also HELD ELECTED OFFICE and been able to affect LEGISLATION.
not to mention that he didn't wait till the last minute to run. did nader get shut out of debates for his positions? no, he threw in his hat AFTER THEY WERE FINISHED.
besides, the media LOVES ralph nader running for president. dennis kucinich? well, they don't like him so much--he might actually get something done. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Fri, March 14, 2008 - 3:52 PM>>>>>>>>>>dennis kucinich? well, they don't like him so much--he might actually get something done.
I think they didn't like him because the media has conflict of interests with what he proposes. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sat, March 15, 2008 - 8:18 AM<I think they didn't like him because the media has conflict of interests with what he proposes.>
true, but i think if they thought he *truly* had a snowball's chance in hell of getting said propositions accomplished (even thru handing off the idea to someone doing better in the horse race) they wouldn't feel the need to shut him out.
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Re: Nader runs again..
Fri, March 14, 2008 - 3:49 PMI think the problem is the reluctance of many progressives to challenge the system with their beliefs in fear that challenging the sytem will only make it worst. History has shown the opposite, but most people don't know much about their own history. You know as a California resident, as I, that it is not likely that California is not likely to have a Republican prez win. But Cal progressives seem to forget that.
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Re: Nader runs again..
Fri, March 14, 2008 - 4:28 PM<<Nader is principled. Can you say the same? >>
Nader is like a leap year cicada, popping up to chirp every four years then crawl back in his hole for the next four years. and his consumer advocacy...years ago.
what i'd like him to do is to run for office on the state level, get a strong movement going that will grow into a national movement. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Fri, March 14, 2008 - 8:17 PMNadar's populism is suspect, due to this Olympic sport of hibernation. The more it sets in my mind, the more a Barak/Dennis team works for me, too.....
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sat, March 15, 2008 - 5:27 AM<<Nader is like a leap year cicada, popping up to chirp every four years then crawl back in his hole for the next four years. and his consumer advocacy...years ago. >>
It's ironic that I keep finding myself in a position of defending Nader in this forum, since I'm actually pretty unhappy with him myself right now, but the things I'm reading about him are just outlandish.
Just because the lamestream media only focuses on his presidential bids doesn't mean Nader spends the rest of his time "in hibernation." Anybody who's been around Ralph Nader knows that he's got a manic work ethic. He probably accomplishes more in a week than most of us do in a year. Since he ran for president in 2000, he has founded two national organizations ( democracyrising.us/ and www.citizenworks.org/ ) & written at least three books I'm aware of (Crashing the Party; The Good Fight; & The Seventeen Traditions), plus countless articles, speaking engagements, etc.
Unless you expect to be accomplishing more than that in your mid-seventies, I think you should give this talk of Nader's "hibernation" a rest. It's utterly unfounded in reality. If you're going to criticize Nader, at least do it for something real. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sat, March 15, 2008 - 6:49 AM...........hibernation from the glaring national spotlight, homie. Many fantastic and, often, galvanizing ideas are published and disseminated to the choir. (I'm pretty sure that puts you back at the goat farm...)
Ralph's work ethic is not in question; just his decisions....if his stated goals involve the dissemination of his conclusions and building a 3rd party of an American cross-section who vote/ discuss the failings of corporatism with 'neighbors'/ support definitive efforts to eliminate the two party monopoly.......
Presidential election infotainment is the medium. It repulses me. ........Still, It is the circus set up on the grounds. Once inside the tent, you're not likely to listen to PETA.
OR...to put it another way: Ralph's current approach to the national spotlight has the same effect as your Uncle Steve appearing every few years with a fifth of Bushnells under his belt. He may be the only family member insightful enough to save the homestead, but no one will listen.......
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sat, March 15, 2008 - 8:35 PMYeah. It's about time somebody got moving. This world is so slow.
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sun, March 16, 2008 - 1:05 AM<<not only has he addressed all the things you're attibuting to nader he's also HELD ELECTED OFFICE and been able to affect LEGISLATION.>>
Nader has been busy keeping elected officials accountable. His running is obviously a move for social protest to bring light to the hypocrisies in American political culture. Thank God.
The issues today are just as important as the issues 50, 100 and 200 years ago. The system has to be agitated in order to progress. Nader is brilliant, and he's non-violent in his approach, while still presenting an integrated critique. That's huge in my book.
As far as legislation goes, maybe you should read about Nader and see how much legislation he's affected. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sun, March 16, 2008 - 9:30 AM.......you Cali's would know.....if Ralph ran for Congress, would he get a groundswell to lift him to D.C?
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sun, March 16, 2008 - 8:21 PM<<Nader has been busy keeping elected officials accountable.>>
citations, please.
<<His running is obviously a move for social protest to bring light to the hypocrisies in American political culture.>>
we can not afford another conservative appointment to the supreme court. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sun, March 16, 2008 - 9:39 PM>>>>>>>>>>>we can not afford another conservative appointment to the supreme court.
There all conservative and have corporate interest. Anyway if a candidate is undesirable, than his or her court appointee is going to be just as undesirable. This by the way is not meant to be an argument against Obama in of itself. I think people get so caught up with the idea the if we do this or that then the whole world will fall apart and then we accomplish less. It is about time that we focus on accomplishments than a stagnant candidate. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Tue, March 18, 2008 - 11:40 AM
"They're all conservative and have corporate interest."
Not so Dennis Kucinich, unless I am being naive and am mistaken about this candidate. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Tue, March 18, 2008 - 9:00 PMWell, no you are not mistaken. If he has any interest, it is very far under the radar, and may not be as badly influenced.
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Re: Nader runs again..
Sun, March 23, 2008 - 3:38 PM<Nader has been busy keeping elected officials accountable.>
hmm... quick look says he's doing a lousy job--or not keeping ENOUGH people accountable.
<His running is obviously a move for social protest to bring light to the hypocrisies in American political culture. Thank God.>
why can't he do that by just POINTING THEM OUT instead of running for president? what i wish he would do was get a tv show or a segment on one so that he could educate the populace *for real* instead of for a few months out of every 4 years. i hate people running for president "to make a point."
<Nader is brilliant, and he's non-violent in his approach, while still presenting an integrated critique. That's huge in my book.>
who's violent in their approach?
<As far as legislation goes, maybe you should read about Nader and see how much legislation he's affected.>
a little help? still, i think he'd be more effective in a position where he could vote on or introduce legislation. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Mon, March 24, 2008 - 8:10 PMThere is the problem that lies, is that the election of candidates does a poor job of holding people accountable. Note that I was careful not to make the claim that Nader makes people accountable, though I do think he brings up certain issues. We no not live in a real democracy. We live in a pretend democracy. -
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Re: Nader runs again..
Wed, March 26, 2008 - 9:23 AMNader has run for President of the United States five times (in 1992, 1996, 2000, 2004 and 2008).
4 of those times, and this one too, he will have been told that the majority do not want him as president.
He doesn't care about that, he just wants to be the one who affects the race.
He has affected races, in a scary poll from the other day, he garnered 18% of those polled(I can guess the coastline on that) if it were down to Obama, McCain and h
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